Re: Ryan's 4" lift

["Ryan Moore" <baradium@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "T.R.E. Jr." <T_R_E_Jr@domain.elided>
To: "Ryan Moore" <baradium@domain.elided>
Cc: "IHC Digest" <IHC-Digest@domain.elided>
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2003 01:13
Subject: Re: Ryan's 4" lift


> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ryan Moore" <baradium@domain.elided>
>
> <snip>
> > If you have such long shackles, do you have braces between the shackles
> > (IE
> > between the two sides of each shackle) to stop them from leaning?  I've
> > seen
> > methods of sticking square tubing there and it seems to work quite well
> > for
> > those people.
>
>
> ---Not a method, an actual design for heavy duty shackles. H-type shackles
> are the only thing I would suggest, whether you have a lift, extended
> shackles or stock ride. I have pulled too many of the original shackle
> plates to find that they were twisted. There is  lot of stress on them
when
> turning and whipping around a corner does more than destroy the wheel
> bearings. The H-type does not allow that twist and keeps the shackle end
of
> the spring straighter by being more structurally stabile. I had all
> intentions of going with H-type even if I didn't buy a 4" lift kit.
>

I'm with you on that... however, I don't see a way to go H-type with a
stocke length shackle, and that so far has kept me from changing because I
do not want to change my steering doing that...

> ---BTW, installing a shackle that is longer than 2" is like stacking 4"
> block to get an 8" lift to me. Key word, unsafe. The longer the object,
the
> more torque can be applied, sort of like putting a cheater bar (pipe) on
the
> end of a ratchet or using a breaker bar rather than a ratchet. Installing
a
> 4" extended shackle to correct a 2" lift is just ridiculous TO ME. Might
be
> a cheap fix, but undue stress to the frame and shackle is not my idea of
> fixing the problem.
>

Agree with you there too...  it's still better than the 12" shackles I've
seen before.

> ---I'll still stick with what I know from what I originally read from a
> write-up in a tech article, where it was said that the main objective is
to
> keep the original horizontal position of the drag link when the lift is
> complete. Common sense tells you that if you change the caster by rotating
> the axle, then you don't change the toe or camber, you rotate the axle or
> the knuckles to bring the correct caster back. Bump steer cannot be that
> hard to fix, it wasn't there to begin with, so whatever steering
attributes
> that were changed need to be corrected (period).
>

One of the changes, however, is people who go with the softer springs etc
because they want car like ride quality from a truck.

> ---A z-bar or dropped drag link may work for one, but as we know and from
> what we read on Tom M.'s site, every lift is different so what is good for
> one may not work for another. Ryan, you say your Triangle is a 4" lift,
but
> more like a 2" now? The bar that you would create for your lift now would
> not work for mine. My Skyjacker system after 2

What bar are we talking about?  I don't have any type of aftermarket bar?
BTW, a  z-draglink doesn't change any geometry anyways.

years still retains 90% of
> it's lift, if not 95%. Two more years and I would think that I can find a
> medium and install components, to correct the drag link angle and length,
> then when I replace the springs, bumpsteer won't be noticeable and if the
> springs settle from the weight, it won't be negative. Then again, by then,
I
> will have the S-OC rather than cradled springs. Hmmmm, maybe a bus gear
box
> to replace the Scout box, giving me a larger and possibly longer shaft. I
> think I could create a mounting plate that would work to protect the frame
> from undue stress, just have to find a box that will fit in the area... or
> maybe go to hydraulic steering... is that legal for roadways?
>

I need to get next to someone with a new lift with the same sized tires to
know for sure.  It could also be the amount of stuff in the back of the
scout causing it to sit down a little bit, but the springs seem a little
stiff to sit down that much.... need to get a weight of the scout....

I always heard full hydraulic steering is illegal... but some people who
have hydraulic steering dissagreed....  you can also go to ram assist
steering, which has a hydraulic ram used in conjuction with a mechanical
linkage.


> ---Thank you,
> -T.R.E.Jr.
> -`73 Scout II (StoneThrower)
> -`51 Farmall H (Heinz)
> -`49 IH fridge (presently unnamed and in need of a compressor)
> -`49 Plymouth Special Deluxe 4-door Sedan (Papapalooza)
>

-Ryan